Episode Transcript
[00:00:06] Speaker A: Welcome to five Minute Film Finder, brought to you by Pioneer Library System.
[00:00:14] Speaker B: Hi. Welcome back to another episode of Five Minute Film Finder with Pioneer Library System. My name is Samuel, and today I am joined by Ben.
[00:00:23] Speaker A: Hey, Sam.
[00:00:24] Speaker B: Hey.
[00:00:25] Speaker A: I will not call you Sam.
[00:00:26] Speaker B: That's okay.
[00:00:27] Speaker A: We'll allow it this one time. Okay, sorry.
[00:00:29] Speaker B: We'll allow this one time.
You do so much work in the producer booth that we can allow you a little transgression here and there.
[00:00:37] Speaker A: Thank you.
Well, what are we here to talk about today?
[00:00:42] Speaker B: Yeah. So as Summer Learning Challenge ends, we're continuing the spirit of Sad Boy Summer. We're continuing the spirit of Sad Boy Summer. We have some foreign language dramas to discuss today that are.
I think we both decided, notably, we didn't even have to decide this. They're quite sad.
[00:01:02] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:01:04] Speaker B: So just, you know, just up my alley.
[00:01:07] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:01:08] Speaker B: I. I don't know. Do you like a sad drama?
[00:01:11] Speaker A: It has to be the right middle field. Like, these ones were perfect because they weren't devastating.
[00:01:18] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:01:19] Speaker A: Kelsey will. My. My wife Kelsey will put on a lot of, like, devastating movies that I'm just like. I don't know how you put yourself through this, like, turmoil to watch this, but, like, these were, like, good. Like, this is tough, but it's like, you see the growth. It doesn't just feel like it's, like, grinding on you with sadness. It's just like there's a reason for the things that are happening. There's a journey.
So, yes, I do like it, but it has to be the right kind. And I feel like these were, like, two. Two good examples of that.
[00:01:54] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:01:55] Speaker A: And, like, nice deferring examples of, like, family drama.
[00:02:01] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:02:01] Speaker A: If we're. If we're just to broadly categorize them.
Are you big into foreign films?
[00:02:08] Speaker B: I try to be, yeah. Yeah. I.
Early on, as I was starting to get into. Get into, like, watching movies and stuff, I.
Well, I had this. I've talked about, I think, on the podcast before this, you know, the Oxford Very Short Introduction to Film. And in the back, there's around the world in 80 films. And so I've tried to watch some of those. I haven't completed the list, but I've tried to watch as many as I can.
And then I think it was like Martin Scorsese who said something about the importance of people watching foreign films. And he's done a lot of work with the preservation of films around the world because he sort of suggests that American filmmaking has a certain kind of language.
Oftentimes it's loud and in your face and sort of action oriented.
[00:02:52] Speaker A: Absolutely.
[00:02:53] Speaker B: And so he thinks it's just important to like, kind of expose yourself to different kinds of storytelling. And I think just because of my own inclinations around narratives that I like, foreign films often scratch that itch for me, you know?
[00:03:10] Speaker A: Know, I think every episode we've done together has had a foreign film.
[00:03:17] Speaker B: I think so, yeah.
[00:03:19] Speaker A: 71, Battle of Alers and now this.
[00:03:21] Speaker B: Yes, yes.
[00:03:22] Speaker A: We've probably done more than that between me and you, but those are the ones that most recently come to mind. I was like, okay, yeah, yeah, we've got a nice streak here going.
But I think this one, this episode kind of like strikes, I think, a very like kind of classic European drama tone.
[00:03:41] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:03:42] Speaker A: So if you want, we can just go ahead and jump in with your first one. Yeah.
Wilhelm, please start the timer. And Samuel, tell us what we're talking about.
[00:03:51] Speaker B: Yes. So the film I wanted to bring to the table today was Flowers, which is the English title for it, which came out in 2014.
It's actually a Basque film, which I just kind of want to get hung up.
[00:04:05] Speaker A: What is Basque? Yeah, let's explain that.
[00:04:07] Speaker B: The Basque region is in, I believe, northern Spain and southern France.
And if you go there, they will tell you that their language, the Basque language, it's its own language, is outside of the tree of languages.
So there's not really.
[00:04:22] Speaker A: And it is interesting because, like, listening to them talk, I did have like that knee jerk response of like, is this Germanic? Is this Latin based? And like. And it just kind of has it its own feeling.
[00:04:35] Speaker B: Yes, yes. And it's so fascinating because there's a little bit of Spanish in the beginning when one of the characters is at the doctor's office. And then the rest of it, as far as I could tell, was in Basque. And it just sounds so different from that little hint of Spanish at the beginning.
And it is fascinating because they have a very, in many ways traumatic history within Spain.
And I actually came across this film while I was in the Basque country of Spain and was actually doing a tour. And the tour guide, she had studied film and I was like, oh, that's so cool. What are some film recommendations? And this was one of them. So this was kind of a fun. I finally watched it.
[00:05:21] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:05:21] Speaker B: Nice.
[00:05:22] Speaker A: Full circle.
[00:05:22] Speaker B: Yeah, full circle moment for me. But yeah. And so it's like just setting aside plot and character development. I think it's a cool thing to just watch a movie in a language that you've maybe not heard ever.
[00:05:36] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:05:37] Speaker B: And. And is has still survived to this day, which is not very common for. For minority languages.
[00:05:44] Speaker A: Absolutely.
[00:05:45] Speaker B: And. And especially in a place like Spain where, like, everyone speaks Spanish. Yeah. Like, Basque has continued despite also some. Some history of repression.
[00:05:53] Speaker A: Sure.
[00:05:53] Speaker B: During Franco's reign, if I'm getting my names and dates right. But.
So I think that's really cool. It's just a testament to the survival of this language and the people of that. Of that. Of that region.
But also it is, I thought, a really good film.
[00:06:08] Speaker A: Yeah. It is all kind of beautifully shot.
[00:06:11] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:06:11] Speaker A: Like, I, like, constantly throughout, I was just like, wow, this is. This just looks really nice.
[00:06:17] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:06:18] Speaker A: For what they're trying to portray, which is generally sad. Yeah. It's like they managed to, like, beautifully portray very, like, sad moments, but also, like the beauty in those sad moments. Yeah.
[00:06:29] Speaker B: Yeah. And so kind of the general plot is it kind of centers around three characters or four characters. It's this woman, she starts receiving flowers, and they're not from her husband, and there's no note.
It kind of drives the husband crazy. And eventually she starts hiding the fact that she's receiving these flowers from him and she's just taking him to work.
Where a crane operator notices them, is like, oh, those are beautiful flowers. And then they have a conversation. She had lost a chain that was a gift from her husband, and her and her boss had taken out a metal detector at a construction site. So not very successful venture to recover it. And the crane operator was like, oh, I noticed you were looking around. She's like, yeah, I couldn't find what I was looking for. And then it goes to the crane operators kind of story where he's in this difficult marriage relationship with his mother because his wife and his mother don't get along. His mother wants them to have another child. The wife seemingly doesn't want them to have another child.
[00:07:35] Speaker A: Has a child from a former relationship.
[00:07:36] Speaker B: Yes, yes.
And there's all this tension.
But then you notice that he has a flower garden and he really likes his flower garden.
And this is kind of a spoiler, but he. He dies tragically in a car crash. And it kind of. Then the flowers stop to the woman at the construction site.
But then she figures out, oh, this was the guy who was sending me flowers. They find her chain in his crane booth.
[00:08:07] Speaker A: And the interesting thing of this whole story is the flower mechanic of it all is all implicit. It's never explicit of, like, they show him as, like, yep, he's the guy.
[00:08:18] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:08:19] Speaker A: It's always just like, well, this must be it.
[00:08:21] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:08:22] Speaker A: But like, they kind of intentionally obfuscate that to be like, it's, it's not about that.
[00:08:27] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:08:27] Speaker A: Yeah. Yes.
[00:08:28] Speaker B: Yeah. In many ways it's like the, the ambiguity is important because, because it then brings this woman from the construction site, his co worker, into the lives of his family because she starts leaving flowers at the crash site.
And in many ways it becomes like a vehicle for the relationships between the mother in law and daughter in law.
[00:08:51] Speaker A: There's Wilhelm. But we're gonna keep talking because we just barely got into this. Yeah, yeah, keep going.
[00:08:58] Speaker B: So it brings this woman into relationship with these other two women and in many ways it's about sort of navigating, I think.
I don't want to impose too much meaning on the film itself, but like the mother's despair over not having a relationship with her daughter in law that she wanted and a grandchild, the wife's maybe despair. I think there's some guilt, I think there's some recognition that her marriage wasn't perfect and, and she very much wanted more, but couldn't quite get that from, from the situation.
And now she's starting to think that maybe she drove her husband to infidelity, which never occurs. Right. Like, like as you know.
And we don't even know if he was sending the flowers or not.
[00:09:53] Speaker A: Yeah. And that's interesting. And like, I think like a small theme of it is like the idea that like how much these small acts.
[00:10:02] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:10:03] Speaker A: Can like spin out somebody's life.
Like just like, oh, just getting flowers. And like the act of like giving flowers is like. And I think they like kind of intentionally poke at that multiple times in the film of being like, it's flowers. What harm could it be like to be like, oh, no. Yeah, it is harmful to this person.
[00:10:26] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.
[00:10:27] Speaker A: Totally innocent to this other person.
[00:10:29] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:10:30] Speaker A: And I thought that was an interesting way of like poking at. It was like, oh, yeah. Like if you, if you're breaking it down, like, yeah, flower. Giving flowers is a totally innocent thing, but it's all in the interpretation of an act.
[00:10:44] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.
[00:10:45] Speaker A: A small act of like just like, of kindness.
[00:10:48] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:10:49] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:10:50] Speaker B: And that's the other thing is the kindness is like, I think towards the end of the movie I started to feel like regret, like over, like, have I been as truly kind to the people in my life as I should be? Right.
[00:11:05] Speaker A: Because.
[00:11:06] Speaker B: Because in many ways, like each character is suffering from a lack of kindness from someone else and. Right. Like the first woman, at the very beginning, it's like, hey, you have menopause. At a very young age. Right. Like.
[00:11:20] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:11:21] Speaker B: And. And there's a way in which her and her husband, they don't really talk to each other. It's like.
[00:11:25] Speaker A: Yeah, they seem disconnected. Yeah.
[00:11:27] Speaker B: Y. Yeah. And that act of kindness, of receiving flowers changes. Like, you start to see her seem happier, but then there's also this conflict that comes between her and her husband.
In the same way, the flowers being left at the crash site makes the mother happy because for her remembrance is so important. Right. This comes up like as soon as you stop remembering someone who has passed, they are truly dead at that point.
And so, and so this person who's taking the time to leave flowers where her son passed away.
[00:12:00] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:12:01] Speaker B: That is, that is of such great significance to her that it really makes her happier.
[00:12:06] Speaker A: And, and on the flip side of that, from the, the, the widow, like the act of somebody leaving those flowers is like a sign of betrayal.
[00:12:16] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:12:16] Speaker A: What does this mean? Yeah, it's like, it's interesting. Like constantly overlaying this. Like this simple act can mean so many things depending on where you're looking at it from.
[00:12:26] Speaker B: Yeah. And the scene where, okay, so the guy who passes away, he had donated his body to science basically. So the family.
[00:12:37] Speaker A: That was an interesting run.
[00:12:38] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:12:39] Speaker A: Like to like have that be an element of the whole thing.
[00:12:41] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. But I think it really like brings it home because it delays. It delays their sense of closure around his death.
[00:12:48] Speaker A: Yeah. And I think the whole movie takes the course over the like maybe seven years.
[00:12:52] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:12:52] Speaker A: I think something like that.
[00:12:53] Speaker B: There's a couple fast forwards. Right. Yeah. And.
And when it finally comes to a close, when they receive his body back, which he was cremated. Right. They receive his ashes. I think in that moment the widow, I think she starts to see what could have been between her and her mother in law. But it is because I don't want to spoil this part, but because of the nature of things, like it is, it is like.
It is not the depth of what it could have been. Right. Like, it is the appearance of what could have been like a very beautiful relationship between mother in law and daughter in law.
[00:13:37] Speaker A: Yeah. It was sad the way of the mechanic of how they like were like, oh, what. What could have been? Yeah. I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah. That, that part I think got me the most. Is this is.
[00:13:49] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:13:50] Speaker A: Rough. Yeah.
[00:13:51] Speaker B: And. Yeah. And then. Yeah, no, it was, it was rough. It was rough. So.
But I'm so glad I watched this movie. Like, it, it really moved me and it got me thinking of like, have I like have I withheld kindness where I should have not. Yes, you're right. Like. Like when. When I should have been kind.
[00:14:11] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:14:12] Speaker B: Which maybe you don't want to sit in those feelings for a long time, but. But it is. I think.
I don't know. I think. I think sometimes movies at their best, they get us to think differently about ourselves in the world around.
[00:14:25] Speaker A: Absolutely. And I think especially, like, these kinds of dramas are really asking those questions and asking the audience to ask those questions.
I would absolutely recommend this film. It's beautifully shot.
It is.
It is definitely a slower pace. Like, pretty typical, like, European drama pace, but not in a, like, slog way because, like. Yeah, that can get me sometimes where it's like the. The slowness and the ponderance of the pacing can really just be like, okay, can we just get to the next part? But, like, it. It all felt really of a point, like in, like, taking a breath whenever it was, like.
[00:15:03] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:15:04] Speaker A: Having just a moment of, like, silence and like, just like, showing you, like, people in their places, in their thoughts and their feelings. It never felt like, well, come on, just like, let's see what happening there.
[00:15:15] Speaker B: There. So I kind of watched this over two days and there are natural breaking points. Right. There are parts where I was like, oh, I need to pause this. I need to go run this errand. Perfect. You know, there's some. There's almost an episodic quality to the storytelling of it.
[00:15:29] Speaker A: So.
[00:15:29] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:15:32] Speaker A: Well, great. So that was Flowers. And we will take a quick break and then we'll be back with our next film.
[00:15:37] Speaker B: Awesome.
[00:15:45] Speaker A: And we are back.
I'll have Wilhelm kick us off and then I'm going to talk about our next film, which is 2025's sentimental value.
I'll kick us off by reading the IMDb plot synopsis.
An intimate exploration of family memories and the reconciliatory power of art.
That's really good.
[00:16:12] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:16:13] Speaker A: A lot of times when we read those, it's kind of. Kind of seems like they're focusing on the wrong, like, mechanical plot points. But this is very, like, kind of like keyed in on the themes of this film, which, like, I mean, I guess that's all there really is here because it is very much about relationships. There's, like, a lot of things happening in this movie. But did you like this film? Oh, yeah, I really enjoyed it.
I almost always like Stellan Skarsgard. Yeah. He's a fascinating actor and, like, can, like, really eke out a lot from a seemingly blank face.
[00:16:56] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:16:57] Speaker A: But this. This Movie was another tough one. Sad about the relationship between a former formerly big, but I think still like well regarded director.
[00:17:12] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:17:13] Speaker A: And it's been 15 years since his last feature film and he's decided to make this new film and he wants his daughter to be in it. Yeah. She refuses.
[00:17:26] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:17:26] Speaker A: She's a famous stage actor. Yeah. And producer, I assume.
She seems very involved. To be more than just an actress.
[00:17:36] Speaker B: I think. So the. The subtitles suggested a series which I'm wondering if that's like the English, like the, the UK English. Like maybe she was in a TV show, some eyes or something.
[00:17:47] Speaker A: I think that must be it.
[00:17:48] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:17:49] Speaker A: But I don't know, there's. This one has a lot of parallels. Like you were mentioning about like family. And they have this mechanic of talking about the house, which I thought was beautiful. I love that first snippet, talking about the house. Like, I was like, is this gonna be like a warm film? Because, like, this feels kind of nice and then like it slowly like trickled in some info about like the, the hard times of the family and it's like, okay, okay, there, there's. There's the drama. But like, it felt like very like, almost like. Like whimsical and magical in the beginning.
[00:18:32] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:18:32] Speaker A: Just because it starts panning over like a beautiful park in Norway and then showing this house and like it's got beautiful greenery around it and it's like a classic kind of like old house.
[00:18:44] Speaker B: Yeah. Very striking.
[00:18:45] Speaker A: Hundreds of years old, of course.
And I was just like, oh, this is.
I want to sit in this for a moment. But like, I think what I can say about this one, similar to the other one, it doesn't hit you over the head with the grief or the sadness of the actions that take place or the things that are portrayed.
It is. It does like kind of parse them out in like nice little bits so that like you can kind of digest them without it being overwhelming.
[00:19:16] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:19:18] Speaker A: I don't know. I'm saying a lot of things. What, what thoughts did you have about this?
[00:19:22] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, I was so.
[00:19:25] Speaker A: I mean,
[00:19:29] Speaker B: what this, the experience I was having while watching this movie, not dissimilar from when I was watching Flowers, was the sense that these characters are. Are all suffering and they're kind of within their.
Within themselves.
[00:19:45] Speaker A: Yes. And.
[00:19:47] Speaker B: And from an external perspective, it's like, you know, what if you just talked with. What if you just talked with one another? What if you just like, you know.
[00:19:56] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:19:57] Speaker B: Maybe a more diplomatic way. Right. Because they have legitimate grievances, particularly the daughters, I think, to the father, I
[00:20:03] Speaker A: think a very, like, class of, like. Well, that's just how they are. And assuming that nothing can change. Assuming that nobody can be better or come around.
[00:20:12] Speaker B: Yeah.
And not, like, seeking that sense of understanding. Because I think the thing that hit home to me was the immense amount of suffering they've all experienced.
And, like, so the sin. Skarsgrd's character, his mother, well, you know, she commits suicide, Right.
And she had been an anti Nazi, like, propagandist during the war, and she was tortured because of it, and she had this rough life. And he is, like, taking on those scars, and he doesn't manage them well. And as a result.
[00:20:54] Speaker A: But obviously, we'll go on.
Yeah. And the generational trauma, I think, is. Is the poppy, the current popular term for that kind of stuff. But, like, it was interesting to see the, like, the mirroring actions and, like, the Stellan Star scars are, as a father, like, seeing, like, something that happened with his mother that was so formative and traumatizing, seeing it echoed in his daughter and. Yeah. And, like, that kind of, like, being a, like, changing force for him.
[00:21:33] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. No, it's like his daughters have legitimate grievances. Right. He was not the most present father.
[00:21:44] Speaker A: He's very much portrayed as, like, I want to. I want to be a total artist. Like, why? Like, he has a little.
Not quite a monologue, but a spiel about talking about, like, artists need liberty. Yeah. Like, why shouldn't I be able to sleep with the actresses that are. That I'm working with? And they're just like, oh, come on. Yeah, come on with this nonsense. Why did you have kids if you wanted that?
[00:22:11] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:22:12] Speaker A: And I think that is. That is an interesting conversation to me, like, in the sense of just, like, people making the excuse of like, to make art, I need to be able to do whatever crazy stuff I want to do. Yeah. It's like, that's an excuse a lot of people use to do a lot of terrible things.
[00:22:32] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's. It's just, it. It does feel like this outworking of some deep fear within him that.
That.
I don't know. I don't want to say that. Like, you know, if someone had just listened to him once, like, maybe his life would have been different. But there's a way in which the.
The thing that changes is, like, they read his script, Right. His daughters read his script.
[00:22:59] Speaker A: That turning point where, like, they're, like, so resistant, and then finally they're like, something's different.
[00:23:07] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And this.
[00:23:08] Speaker A: This is a different thing. Yeah.
[00:23:10] Speaker B: And there's a way in which while they were maybe siloed off from each other, now they converge.
[00:23:17] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:23:18] Speaker B: As a family.
And it's not an easy thing, but it is.
Maybe it's possible. Yeah, maybe it's possible. And that's. I don't know.
[00:23:29] Speaker A: Yeah. I enjoyed the visual metaphor because they keep the house as part of it. The visual metaphor of, like, at different times in his life, he has basically stripped this house to the bones and redone it.
And how at the end, it's like, nope, doing it one more time.
[00:23:51] Speaker B: I don't care for the final transformation.
[00:23:54] Speaker A: So, yeah, it felt very modern, sterile, but I liked it as an idea.
[00:24:00] Speaker B: Yeah. The metaphor is great.
[00:24:02] Speaker A: At first, when it showed him doing it, I was like, oh, is he gonna reset it back to how it was before? Like, colorful and more traditional. Ye. For. For the area and. Oh, no, they. They just made it nice. They just made it a nice modern, but also, like, kind of like character less.
[00:24:17] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. Millennial minimalist. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But. But it is. Yeah, it's.
[00:24:23] Speaker A: The metaphor is good.
[00:24:24] Speaker B: The metaphor is good. And I think it is a testament to. The movie itself. Is like. It's a very beautiful film. Right. Like.
[00:24:30] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:24:31] Speaker B: It does things intentionally, and.
I don't know. I.
I was moved by it.
[00:24:37] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. I watched both of these movies back to back, and. Oh, yes. I feel, like, emotionally drained. Like, I need to go just watch some. A dumb comedy or something to just, like, be like. Yeah, okay.
[00:24:52] Speaker B: I'm still recovering, I think, for sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I would not recommend watching these back to back.
[00:24:57] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. These are separate watches. Unless. Unless this just is the type of thing that juices yet.
[00:25:02] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:25:03] Speaker A: Which, I mean, good on you. Yeah.
I think that's all we have to say.
This film was obviously a Oscar winner. Oscar, multiple nominations this past year, so we know that lots of you have probably heard of this one. But you should absolutely check out flowers as well.
[00:25:29] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:25:31] Speaker A: This was a nice, I think, into sad boy summer.
[00:25:36] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:25:36] Speaker A: Well, maybe get on to some lighter fare for the next one. Or are you gonna go to the. The 25th anniversary of Fast and Furious?
[00:25:46] Speaker B: You know, I've not seen the original.
[00:25:48] Speaker A: I know you have it, and that's why I want to know if you're gonna go.
[00:25:52] Speaker B: I might have to.
[00:25:53] Speaker A: Okay, Good to. I think. I think we're trying to plan it. Okay.
[00:25:56] Speaker B: Okay. Okay.
[00:25:57] Speaker A: Well, a very fast and furious summer to you all. Yeah. This has been 5 Minute Film Finder. You can email us at podcastioneerlibrary system.org if you have anything that you want to share or any questions or anything that you would like us to cover. Other than that, that's all.
[00:26:15] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:26:15] Speaker A: Bye.
Five Minute Film Finder is a digital program brought to you by Pioneer Library System in Oklahoma.
All opinions expressed in this episode are those of the host and not those of the organization.
Five Minute Film Finder is produced, recorded and mixed by Ben C. Theme music by Ben C.
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